mad_prophets | Attention all Asgardians!

Hi! This is for Pestiday, Loki and Muriel (although maybe not so much Muriel). The rest of you might like to avert your eyes if you don't want to know about the potential relationships between Odin, Loki, Uriel and Hel.

I hate time disparities.

1) Loki was jealous of Baldur and the attention he was getting from Odin, so he hatched a plan to get rid of Baldur. This has implications for Muriel in that Uriel could be in peril from Loki.

2) Loki wanted to get revenge on Odin, and make him feel what losing a child might be like, for sending his three children away/locking them up/throwing them in the sea, so he killed Baldur. This might mean that Odin hasn't forgiven Loki, and Loki might feel guilty.

3) It was an accident - Loki was playing a harmless prank on Baldur, and didn't know that the wound would be fatal. Loki might feel guilty, and it would weigh heavily on his conscience, which would possibly aggravate his condition, and jeopardize his relationship with Odin.

4) Loki knew that Hel had a crush on Baldur, so he sent him down to accompany her. Hel isn't very happy with Loki about him sending Baldur down to her realm though.

5) It was a complete misunderstanding - Loki was innocent.

6) To protect Baldur from Ragnarok, Odin asked Loki to send Baldur to Hel's realm, which would remain intact after Ragnarok. If so, Hel doesn't know about this.

If anyone has any other ideas, or any options, feel free to chip in. For more information about the probable relationships between these three/four Asgardians, you can refer to this thread.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Yo- I'm back :-)

Well, I am up for everything- I have one additional suggestion. The Norse religion was all about predestination and Loki's reasoning for killing Baldur could be blamed on an reason, but the underlying truth would be that he had no choice in the matter... it is only now when the following of the Asgardians has waned that they have true free will, so now they have the luxury (or curse) to question their actions. It is a little like Odin has with Thor- Odin probably couldn't have cared less about insulting Thor, but now feels guilt for not being a better father- Plus, these characters have been around a long time, and sociel ideas have changed- what was an acceptable thing to do to ones children (or another's) was less cuddly than it is now- while the gods still maintain their basic core, their views might have changed some. They may have adapted.

What does this have to do with anything? I'm not entirely sure, but I think it is stuff we can take into account while we figure out the plans-

Here is my suggestion. Baldur was killed by Loki for a couple of reasons 1) He's the god of chaos and killing Baldur would accomplish that, plus it was pre-destined that he should kill Baldur, so in a way he was just following orders. As for subconscious/coscious reasons, maybe part of his reasoning was to punish Odin for binding his children, maybe part of it was to give Hel's lover to her... maybe there were even more reasons. We always have lots of subconscious reasons for doing things.

Hel, at the time, was probably pleased to have Baldur in her realm, thinking she could win his love. That is why she demanded that all things weep for him. A tough order, but Loki once again worked to keep Baldur in her realm. (assuming that he did this of his own will)

Now, though, as time has gone on, Baldur has become a shell of his former self (perhaps) or perhaps it is just the stigma of shame that has caused him to deteriorate, and Hel sees that keeping him in Hel was not a good thing and blames Loki-

Now I just read all this, and it is not only complex but would dictate the actions of Hel- maybe it won't work- We'll figure something out, though!

If there is a complete consensus that I should change the posts, I will.

Actually, I don't like the idea of deleting the post all that much. It just feels wrong to go back and eddit something that's been there so long. (And if you do delete it, I'd once again be tempted to play the Saxo version, where Loki was an innocent bystander, if he was there at all.)

Well, ok, I can go either way about deleting the post. We'll see.

I probably wouldn't feel too comfortable with it, either. It would be wrong to go and change it to suit our purposes now. I suggested that because it would probably be the easiest way to deal with this problem. And I did say that you can feel free to kick me for it.

^_^' So, the general opinion seems to be mostly against the editing/deleting. We need something else, then. Odin's suggestion sounds very good to me, if Hel can agree to that.

So. Various reasons? Should we combine 1), 2), 4) and Pestiday's suggestions then? XD

No, really, I'm not kidding. Then, because of the complexities of the reasons, they never got around to telling Hel anything at all. Of course, this makes Loki out to be sort of a bad guy (but honestly, he is the chaos god, as Pestiday said), but he could regret it now?

Sounds good to me. Of course, I suspect it's Loki's opinion that matters most.

Well, Loki tends to just consider past things past, so his regret is usually short lived, but I suppose he would feel different where Odin is concerned.

I'm not saying that Loki should be regretful... just suggesting it :Þ You're free to decide if he should be regretful or not. So we're going with this then? A combination of 1), 2), 4) and Pestiday's?

Well, I've got nothing against it, if everybody else agrees.

Yay! Alright.. Now I'll just stalk AIM until I can find Pestiday and ask her.

So because they were gods then, and people believed in them, they had to do what people believed they would do?

Also, why is there shame for Baldur for being in Helheim? (Unless of course it's because of the stigma of being associated with the werak and the cowardly etc)

Oh yeah, the bit about keeping Baldur in Hel. I forgot about that.

Well, Helheim is the equivalant of a Viking Hell- it is where all of the oathbreakers, cowards and traitors go when they die... Those are three of the biggest, baddest no-nos for as Viking... killing, raping... thats fine, but not fighting? You're fucked.

Attention all Asgardians!

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